Seth 360
Give and Take and Another Two Concepts on Change
February 5, 2008
8:25 PM
Seth… Let us welcome all of you this evening. A pleasure to have all of you here again. We have delved into four of my six points that I have wanted to go on with. We shall hopefully depending upon how everything goes deal with the last two. Again, because of the nature of the material I would request that each of you hold back on any questions or comments until the end so that I may delve into this topic if you will in detail.
Great events happen in each of your lifetimes, and they are the most quiet. Most individuals assume that it is the fanfare if you will; the trumpets blaring that announce the change. There are a number of things that one as they mature should come to realize that there are certain things in each existence that once lost you may never recapture. As an example, we will deal with three of them, time, words, and opportunity. Each of these ideas (said very strongly) helps promote change. Out of physical plane existence all individuals are “ruled” by time. You measure it, contemplate it, fear it, you desire more of it, you desire less of it, yet it is the quiet ticking of the clock, the passage through that helps denote the passage from one idea to another. An example here may be seen with the idea of inspiration. The time spent on a project that seems to be leading nowhere is in reality a passage of trial and error and then in the bathtub or toilet, or upon waking from a dream the answer is there. The change, the knowledge has mysteriously appeared. The question arises why now? The answer my dear friend’s is simple. You contemplate that which you desire; you create in the second framework (Seth has spoken about frameworks in previous books by Jane Roberts.) of existence and you bring it into your own in full bloom in a quiet and delicate moment. The most obvious course of events is not noticed until you are ready to see what the universe offers.
I have been asked numerous times why did you not give me this information before. The answer is because you were not ready to appreciate or understand the vital nature of the event itself. Most individuals allow time to “slip through their fingers”. They pray for this, they want for that, yet they do not attract that which they seek since most individuals unfortunately believe that they are not worthy! Most individuals spend too much time being jealous of what someone else has. They do not see since they close their eyes to that which they are and what they are creating. Time is elusive for most it just seems to pass, yet how many individuals leave their home, drive along a country road, and never take “the time” to appreciate, understand, reflect upon, and enjoy the beauty that surrounds them. When they finally return home, they are weary from the trip, and they do not appreciate the others that they have encountered, yet they pine for true companionship. They never give themselves an opportunity to make progress in whatever line of study they choose to be on. Each of you must endeavor to work at making yourself responsible for your own prosperity. Use your time wisely since there is a limited amount of time.
During our break you may ask the man through whom I speak to re-explain the idea of the dash when it comes to time. (During the break I explained the following. If a person lived from 1900–1980 it does not matter how long they lived but by how and what they did between the two dates. That is why the dash is important. Jerry)
When you lose ideas that you can never take back, the word, the choice of its meaning is at times so disastrous that their implications and meanings can never, can never (Said very strongly.) be forgotten. The sound, the stigma of those words that either you have said or have been said to you are still clearly heard thirty, forty, and fifty years after their initial placement. If I was to ask each of you what words do you remember, I am certain that you may come up with ideas that are delicate at best. We have oft said that language and words are the poorest form of communication, for once uttered or written down they can never be erased. Learn to pause, reflect, contemplate the deeper meaning of what you say or write. How often does one hear I really did not mean that, you just don’t understand, that was only a joke, don’t you have a sense of humor? These are but a few (said strongly) of the myriad of phrases that one often uses to remove what has been said. Just as you cannot erase time you cannot erase the feelings that harsh words bring to you. How often do I go around the table and get a working definition of an idea so that each of you can understand what I am speaking about? Learn to think, place yourselves in the position of the other before you utter a sound, before you place pen to paper.
The last idea of that which you have to deal with in terms of Change is the idea of opportunity. The quiet solitude of knowledge gives you the ability to take advantage of that which you are. I will pause here. (The phone in the kitchen was ringing.) When one sees an opening for prosperity but does not act out of fear the opportunity is lost and to achieve the same results you must walk a different path, for that road that you could have been on is now closed. Your choices give you the opportunity for advancement if you choose to take the risk. Stagnation is your enemy. When one delays out of fear your choices become limited and change is more difficult. Each of you must learn to choose wisely so that you become prosperous in whatever endeavor you are embarked upon. The opportunity for advancement surrounds each of you. Unfortunately, the repetitive nature that inhabits the physical plane prevents most individuals from grasping or seeing what the correct choice is.
Examples of this abound. Should I stay or should I leave my country were uttered by individuals during your Second World War. The opportunity to escape what seems to be the inevitable is an indication of dis-ease. Choose wisely for as the old adage goes opportunity only knocks once, and yes, my students it only does! Each time that you miss an opening you will have to find another.
The idea here that each of you is different from one another is an important factor of change itself. What makes individuals and families strong is the idea that one is committed to the family. We place value upon something, and we have oft used the idea of value fulfillment as being necessary for you as an individual to find true enlightenment and happiness. If you are not in a situation where you can commit, then you cannot advance. It is the experience that each of you requires that moves you forward. Families need commitment, yet within the idea of change and commitment one must be sincere. You cannot fool the universe; you cannot pretend to be something when you are something else. You may fool individuals, communities, even countries, but you know what you are. You know what you do not have, you know what you lack and eventually the “others” will find out that you are dishonest!
Lastly to promote change one must view the idea of hard work. We have stated before and will re-state again just because you WANT SOMETHING, the idea of want something should be underlined and capitalized,does not mean (Said strongly and very slowly.) that you will attain it, capture it, or have it. One must work to bring yourself and your family together. You cannot (said strongly) graduate from the school of proper change by letting someone else do the work for you. This does not mean that you should never ask for or seek assistance from another. It is the person who is a loner who chooses to be outside of the community that for the most part makes him/herself a victim of everyone and everything. (Said very strongly.) When you do not choose to give another a chance you are removing yourself from prosperity. One must never judge another by their looks. One must contemplate their actions. In doing so you will often find that their true beauty is immeasurable. One makes the family stronger by participating in their endeavors.
One must commit and be sincere in all that you do or request from someone else. If you do not, then my question is simply this: What have you gained? What have you lost? You have lost your time and have said words that are gone, and you certainly have lost the opportunity to promote yourself as well as the others who are in your family. Just because someone does something even repeatedly that is not to your liking does not mean that one should give up or judge them in a harsh manner. Become the light on a dark stormy night. Become the safe harbor for them as you would choose to have someone do for you. A great event often passes unnoticed, do not lose it, become stronger and make a commitment to self. Period.
I believe at this point we shall take a break.
Seth… So, let us continue: I believe that each of you is starting to appreciate how difficult the ramifications of change itself are. I have used these last numbers of weeks to highlight and give you a push if you will so that you may each contemplate the ideas that I have spoken on.
Are there any questions?
Isabella… I have a question regarding missed opportunities when it comes to my relationships. You made a comment about not being too quick to judge others and about looks and it is more about actions… I really can’t find the right spot, oh it is when you don’t choose to give another a chance you are removing yourself from prosperity, one must never judge another by their looks, one must contemplate their actions in doing so you will also find that their true beauty is immeasurable. What I find is that, especially now that I am doing the dating thing, for example with this guy Tim that I went out with last night or two nights ago. In the beginning of the date, I felt that I could be attracted to him looks wise, and he was a super nice guy, really nice, very complimentary and he was really providing a definite area of growth and opportunity. Midway through the date something shifted in my thinking and it was like that everything that I had been feeling for the first hour completely shut off and I was I don’t know if I like him, I don’t know if I am attracted to him, I don’t know if I want to, you know… and I am very curious as to… and this has happened to me before with nice people, with men that I think I could potentially be a good guy and I tend to become more attracted to the ones that are wounded and have issues then the guys who can provide me with what I am really looking for unfortunately, and I don’t really understand why that shift happens?
Seth… The shift happens because of the definition of self. When you do not feel worthy, when you do not feel comfortable within yourself one tends to push it outward so that you find fault with others. Let me give you an example away from you so that you can understand: Let us assume that a husband or wife goes to a competent therapist, of course none are sitting at the table so we can eliminate them (There were three therapists sitting around the table at this time!) and that individual goes to a therapist and starts making changes within themselves. And after a while it becomes noticeable to the other partner, husband or wife, matters not, that changes are being made how likely is it that the husband or wife who is noticing the changes immediately gravitates and fully appreciates the hard work that the individual who is going to the therapist is doing?
Isabella… I would say not immediately.
Seth… Rarely and it takes a very, very long period of time and you are certainly missing opportunity, and this is due to the idea of fear. If I allow myself to like that individual, if I allow myself to respond to that individual then of course you are opening yourself for “your belief system” that they can hurt you.
Isabella… Right.
Seth… This is what you are doing in terms of; oh, he is nice, he is good looking, he is kind, oh maybe he isn’t, I can’t take the risk in this because I have been hurt so badly. This is one of the reasons why I have stated to you to be casual, at least for the present point of reference.
Isabella… So why wasn’t I afraid to take the risk with George?
Seth… Because you instinctively know that George is a deeply wounded individual. How often have you stated that you know that you could not become involved long range with him because of his difficulties until he gets help? Until he gets help, how often have you stated that?
Isabella… Many times.
Seth… And has he gotten help?
Isabella… No.
Seth … Therefore, you will still be attracted to him because you know that he is a safe individual.
Isabella… Okay, now. (There was an interaction with Jasmine who was answering for Isabella and Seth stated, “Let her figure this out, please.) No, it’s safe because I know that he is not going anywhere, because I can’t potentially be hurt by him because I am not a hundred percent invested in him. And in this other case I am just using this guy as an example, the reason why I would switch it off in my brain would be because of how maybe potentially great he could be and my fear of getting hurt again.
Seth… Correct.
Isabella… So, it is really a fear thing, so how do you get over that?
Seth… By getting over it!
Isabella… Okay.
Seth… Remember there will come a point of reference where you are going to need to not lose an opportunity, you are going to need to become sincere, first with self and then of course with another. This is certainly part of the ideas…
Isabella… So how do I know when… so how do I know that this isn’t the opportunity?
Seth… You do not. But that matters not, it is the opening of yourself up, if you get hurt, injured, bothered, annoyed, or frustrated that is fine because that is a learning experience.
Isabella… Okay.
Seth… Do you understand?
Isabella… I do. In the terms, maybe you have answered it already about this transition with George that we are going through right now where we decided that we are going to take it down a notch and take out the seriousness of it. I was very surprised with his reaction and with his being so okay.
Seth… Why?
Isabella… Why was I surprised?
Seth… Why should you be?
Isabella… I really thought that he was going to be like…
Seth… Why should you be, he has already told you that he does not enjoy communal life.
Isabella… Right. Okay, well I guess that that is a letdown for me. So that’s why I was upset.
Seth… You are not upset, you knew it.
Isabella… Okay, so what is the feeling that I am feeling?
Seth… What you are feeling basically is in a large sense relief.
Isabella… But it doesn’t feel like relief.
Seth… I understand but, it is.
Isabella… Okay. I wanted to just quickly… I’m sorry Steph I know that this is killing you, about this dream that I had last night that even, even some people, you know, very good dream interpreters are having some difficulty trying to answer me. I was on the phone with Jacob, in my dreams and he was… I was mad at him because he was involved in a relationship or starting a relationship with supposedly the person who destroyed our marriage. And I was mad at him for talking to this guy and going on a trip with him and all of this stuff.
Seth… Him or her?
Isabella… It was a him in the dream. And it was like himself, like he was befriending himself. Does that make sense?
Seth… Of course.
Isabella… I really don’t understand. I was having a hard time.
Seth… Who destroyed the marriage?
Isabella… He did.
Seth… So therefore, he was speaking to himself, you realized that he was the one who had the difficulty within the marriage and did nothing to promote himself or you and since he is the one. Remember dreams are about themes…
Isabella… Right.
Seth… not a specific. So therefore, it is he who is responsible and therefore what you are looking at was the idea. Of course, you are angry because he chose not to work.
Isabella… Right, but who was he talking to?
Seth… Himself. You in your dream you had separated that person from himself. Of course, you know that that is not possible, but it is in reality the fact of the dream.
Are there any other questions?
Stephanie… I just wanted to ask; we were talking about the therapy situation. I have a couple; I am not dealing with the couple right now I’m just dealing with the wife but they were about to get divorced whatever it was and I was trying to help the wife to view her issues and become a kinder individual and give this husband a little bit of a break. So, I think that she has been attempting to do that for quite a while but, there are no changes from this other half. And again, I don’t know how true to life her changes are with him, that’s questionable. But I see…
Seth… How can you find out?
Stephanie… Well, he doesn’t want to come to me, I could re-ask and see if he is willing to come back. She has talked about ways that she’s approached him differently but, like you said, he is petrified, this is an extremely pain, wounded person and she has been very, very, very attacking and horrific with him.
Seth… Why would an individual who has been slapped, beaten, and hurt open himself up? So, the question arises is for you to convey to her that he (said strongly) must endeavor whether through you or some other competent individual to explore the pain that he has towards her. For without that exploration, he will always be hurt and always be fearful.
Stephanie… Yeah, I mean literally he just retreats to a room. Now, what if he… did part of him want to pursue this divorce and just get relief and be done?
Seth… It may very well be true.
Stephanie… Why does he not?
Seth… He does not because it is fear of loss.
Stephanie… Right just the idea of the loss?
Seth… Remember, it is fear of being in a situation that is the fear of not having the situation.
Stephanie… Right so the change…
Seth… So, one tends to gravitate towards one and then move back towards the other. And it is a back and forth, it is a negative, negative type of a situation. (At this point to paraphrase, the wife is the main breadwinner making the husband comfortable monetarily but contributes to his staying in this negative situation. There was more discussion on a contact with or a referral for the husband to assist him.)
Stephanie… Okay, so this isn’t now about the marriage becoming better, it’s just about however she chooses to live. Like this is where it would be with them, does she want to stay or go?
Seth… Correct because if he is not willing… remember when there is no change, there is no growth.
Stephanie… Right, but you know how you always state one changes then the other has to.
Seth… No, if I make positive changes and you and I were married and I make positive changes and you do not then I have grown, and you have stayed where you are. Therefore, my growth is independent of yours. So, I have changed, now whether you choose to accept or reject my changes is of course up to you. But if you are rejecting my changes out of fear and will still refuse to do anything then I must move along without you.
Stephanie… So, it is not always true.
Seth… No, it is true, it is absolutely true. I have changed what have you done? You have rejected the change, and you have made another change. If I change, you must. You are just thinking in terms of a positive result, instead of a negative one.
Stephanie… But there has been no change, the person does nothing different.
Frank… The dynamic of the marriage is changed; so, he has changed, because he had to respond to that…
Seth… and refuses to do so, so it’s in a negative way. You are looking at this in terms of a positive idea. Change does not have to be positive.
Stephanie… Okay, but if the person continues to respond in exactly the same fashion and he’s refusing to change his stance no matter…
Seth… The marriage has changed because she has changed. If she has changed and he is still “doing the same thing” he is rejecting what has been offered and that is a change in and of itself.
Stephanie… Okay, so you are saying that the marriage has changed because she is bringing different things into the marriage.
Seth… Correct.
Stephanie… Okay, alright.
Seth… Are there any other questions?
Frank… So, the idea of the opportunity that I had to go to the Super-bowl (party) this Sunday and then ending up winning the television set was….
Seth… How would a prosperous man act?
Frank… He would win a television set! (Group laughter.)
Seth… I believe you have asked and answered your own question.
Frank… Right. Good, I want to go to some other questions. In terms of the other two sessions could you speak a bit about the idea of making your spouse your friend and touching the hand visa-a-vie I guess the concept of looking in the same direction maybe even the concept of “What about me?” (“What about me?” is a concept discussed by Seth a number of years ago. How the tone of that thought or statement “What about me?” is expressed is quite important. It can be the difference between standing up for oneself correctly or being a bully or being a victim etcetera.) Are there other considerations to do this with your spouse?
Seth… Yes, in anything that you would do with a friend you may do with your spouse. The object here is an open line of communication. Too many individuals believe that a thank you when you do something is necessary to show that you appreciate something. Well, when one demands a thank you it is worthless. If on the other hand the thank you comes spontaneously from one individual to another it carries a lot more weight, it becomes weighty. What that means is that the other individual is seeing what you are doing and remember in the long view of things the widest possible angle of view that you have is the idea that, yes, I see what you are doing, and I appreciate it, that which you are. Now, one should never expect change as here and here as an instantaneous factor, but it is the learning to appreciate the idea that someone is trying that matters. So that when you do this with a spouse the tendency for the injured party, if you will, to say oh, I see what they are doing, that is terrific! Well, they may not be able to fully appreciate that which the other is doing for quite a while, because the fear of regression becomes monumental. You understand this, so the idea of…
Frank… Both parties or one? Who has the fear of the regression?
Seth… The fear of the regression is the injured party; that is the factor there. The injured party, the person who gets slapped if you will, so the idea of looking together towards a common goal, towards a commonality is the factor that one must view as profitable. Remember, when you work together you get more things done, when you are only focusing towards each other there is confrontation. You said, he said, they said and it serves no useful purpose, so when you do this with a spouse and you work towards a commonality whether it be grocery shopping, whether it be a lack of argumentative behavior, or whatever you choose to do, but you have a common goal, the idea of moving together towards something is beneficial since you are working towards something together.
Does that answer your question?
Frank… Yeah, I think so. Somewhat in line with that, a couple that I have been seeing for a while who have had a terrible time of it recently and they may be getting divorced and may not be coming back to my office. She had, she was victimized very badly as a youth and was a victim in the relationship as best as I could see, everything was being a victim.
Seth… Taking everything (as a victim) and being one are quite different.
Frank… Right, I understand, and I believe that there was a lot of taking in this case. Now, this couple may never come back, but skill wise and for the next couple who is similar is there something, are there things that I could have been doing differently, are there things that I need to learn to help couples like this one?
Seth… What you have to do is to get them on the same page, so that they can work together. When couples come in, whether it be man and wife, friends, it matters not. When they come in, they are always looking towards each other instead of looking at the same view. The object is to get both of them to do a 180-degree about-face so that they can see where they came from, and then do a 90 degree turn so that they can understand where they want to go.
Frank… When you say that they see where they came from do you mean in terms of, do you mean that quite broadly, like their whole lives, or do you mean that other couple?
Seth… Yes! You ended up looking…
Frank… There you are, this is what you created.
Seth… This is what you are creating there. For you are only creating this because of that!
Frank… Because of where you came from?
Seth… Right.
Frank… Together and apart?
Seth… Correct, and therefore when you create that, (Said with emphasis.) you get that! Therefore, you want to have them examine that.
Frank… So that they can go back, and that can be done in almost an infinite number of ways?
Seth… In any way that is necessary that the individual themselves come to the conclusion that what happens here may not be relevant to here but only this becomes relevant.
Frank… Okay. (Said very softly) One other question. Is it better for me to talk to Jerry about the idea of lack and the need to re-program. The need for me to begin to re-program. Any guidelines or suggestions?
Seth… Two words, Do It.
Frank… Okay, thank you.
Are there any other questions?
Let me leave you with this; Things that are lost will not fulfill your needs; they increase your wants. Your family and the differences therein make you a stronger and better individual. Your needs will be fulfilled. Work, dedication will give you prosperity.
I bid you all a fond good evening.
Everyone said good night.
(Session ended at 10:00 PM)